www.sdpathram.com

It is shocking to note that the Pentecostal leaders are going to active politics. Let us discuss the pros and cons of this problem.

It is not only shocking but also it is shameful for the pentecostals to get involve in active politics. Did they foreget the vision of our forefathers who turned ther blood to sweat to gain one sole??  What is the actual motive of this rally?  Instead of trying to gain a sinner to God, the leaders involved in this rally is trying to gain assembly seats and minority commission seat.  It is WRONG, SHAMEFUL, and UNACCEPTABLE.  Every one has their own freedom to choose.  If these leaders choose to involve in active politics, it is fine but they should get out of the church and from the position they are holding in the church and then do what ever they want to do.  It should not be in the expenses of the churches.  If they still doing it, I personally will stop all the financial support to the church.  I will not support such nonsense for personal benifits and advantage.

 

Thank you sdwoni for bringing this up in your publication and I applaude your courage.

Well said. These leaders have become spiritually blind. They have forsaken the true God and have gone to mammon. Don't trust them anymore. Let us warn our fellow believers to keep away from these leaders.

A lot of people sacrificed themselves to teach, preach the truth, that is why pentacostals are here now.

But now a few people want power, they are just like the dogs going to their own vomits.

Shame on pentacostal leaders, publishers, who want fame. I will say Marthoma, Jacobite leaders are much better in this respect

AS LONG AS PEOLE SUPPORT THESE SO CALLED LEADERS THEY WILL DO ANY KINDS OF CLOWN ACTS.MOST OF THE PEOPLE DO NOT WANT SPEAK AGAINST THEM , BECAUSE THEY ARE AFRIED OF THE RETALIATION AND GUNDA.." THEY  HOLD THE MONEY BAG"

LIKE JUDAS .

Talking about church politics.... bethel AG in Blr has also become one parliament house. due to this bad state, members are leaving the church and going. Politics in that church is gone to extremes... they are supporting leaders of BJP party and giving them stage to come and do election campaign in the stage. The church has bought a 5 acre land in Blr and they will surely build a parliament house at this rate of politics that is there. And last sunday when he was preaching he admitted for the first time that Pt.MAVarghese has written the whole church land in his name and not in the name of Assembly of God and he is wanting to handover it to his both sons, so he is throwing all the senior pastors out of the church? I am hearing that Pt.MAVarghese is not the gentleman he was. I was attending the convention 2 weeks before and i heard about him that he is speaking badly about pastors from his church to us.  All are calling him a LIAR. Is he a true pastor? What kind of politics is going on there? It is like president rule over there!

Good God Please show mercy!

One Brother

TVM

The ONE BROTHER (TVM)

Whoever you are, there is a certain limit to blow things out of proportion. But u have proved that you are one of the biggest gas bag i hope u understant the meaning of that. U should get ur facts and figures right. Its very wrong to qoute anything and everything that a barin can fantasise about. Jesus didnt come to save the rightoues but the sinners and if u dont understand then u not a christian. Just bcos the world jumps into a well i dont think even u ll do that, that is if u sensible enough. lastly i just want to add this instance from the bible and if u are sensible u ll get the message. JOHN 8 Verse 1-10 but i am quoting the 10th verse. "IF ANY ONE OF U IS WITHOUT SIN, LET HIM BE THE ONE TO THROW A STONE AT HER." Hope that makes some sense to u.

 Would want to end my post by asking u a question, if ur father punishes u would u hit him back or be submissive?????

GOD BLESS...

These leadres are no more tunes to the holy spirit. Lord is going to bring judgemnet on so called leaders who become worldly and evil

Anonymous:

The ONE BROTHER (TVM)

Whoever you are, there is a certain limit to blow things out of proportion. But u have proved that you are one of the biggest gas bag i hope u understant the meaning of that. U should get ur facts and figures right. Its very wrong to qoute anything and everything that a barin can fantasise about. Jesus didnt come to save the rightoues but the sinners and if u dont understand then u not a christian. Just bcos the world jumps into a well i dont think even u ll do that, that is if u sensible enough. lastly i just want to add this instance from the bible and if u are sensible u ll get the message. JOHN 8 Verse 1-10 but i am quoting the 10th verse. "IF ANY ONE OF U IS WITHOUT SIN, LET HIM BE THE ONE TO THROW A STONE AT HER." Hope that makes some sense to u.

 Would want to end my post by asking u a question, if ur father punishes u would u hit him back or be submissive?????

GOD BLESS...

 It is true that Jesus came to save the sinners but Jesus cannot save anyone who is not ready to repent. If the brother from TVM said the truth, the matter is serious. John 8:1-10 won't save people who continues in sin. This is not the way to respond when serious matter is raised. Stealing public money cannot be justified using any Bible verse.

the mukhapresungham was one of the best things published in sdpathram ever. that was so timely and wonderful. glad to see that the media is playing the corrective voice it should. yes, we need to question , where are we going?? what is happened to pentecostals??? we are losing our identity. lets all unite and pray!

I totally agree with posting 3120.  sdpathram is getting better and better and the "MUKHPRASANGAM' is the best.  That will take all of us to realise that where we were and where are we now. Our present leaders, who initiate this rally lost their vision of our 1st generation who struggled to bring the pentecostalism this far.  Their only vision is personal gain and advantage which is very sad.  I hope every one will read that.  SERIOUS THOUGHTS AND STRONG WORDS.

 

I really appreciate sdpathram for standing up against this and that was the voice of thousands and thousands of pentecostal believers.  Let our voice be heard against such act like "Million men March".  What a shame.

Mr./Ms/Mrs. Whoever you are,

I was not taught in church what the is meaning of Gas-bag, maybe your church teaches you all that. I am not throwing stones at anybody. This thread speaks of church politics and this is what i am simply doing. I have my right of speech over here, a privelege that sdpathram and my country has given me to voice my opinion. Dont you feel so guilty of standing with these so called pastors and leaders?. And during my last post and this post, i have got the opportunity to email and phone many in Bangalore and everybody has to say the say the same things. They say that the peoiple who i have spoken about in my previos post have become liars and they use the church stage to take revenge on other pastors and leaders and throw out whoever they feel like and humiliate them. That person is jealous of other pastors who are growing in the annointing and falsely critisising them. What is the affairs of the church now. We once looked upto that church and pastor, now i have lost all my respect. I have found all this from a very trustworthy source.

God save them.

Lintu -tvm 

Dear Lintu,

Please wait...

Be not decieved; God is not mocked...

time will prove it all. At the end of it all it is not good for anyone to sit back and think that their words caused unwanted judgement to them and that without knowing the whole truth someone judged some anointed servants of God.

M C Samuel

How come sworgeeyadwoni does not publish any news that supports this rally?  There are other media that are publishing both supporting and against news. 

Anonymous:

Talking about church politics.... bethel AG in Blr has also become one parliament house. due to this bad state, members are leaving the church and going. Politics in that church is gone to extremes... they are supporting leaders of BJP party and giving them stage to come and do election campaign in the stage. The church has bought a 5 acre land in Blr and they will surely build a parliament house at this rate of politics that is there. And last sunday when he was preaching he admitted for the first time that Pt.MAVarghese has written the whole church land in his name and not in the name of Assembly of God and he is wanting to handover it to his both sons, so he is throwing all the senior pastors out of the church? I am hearing that Pt.MAVarghese is not the gentleman he was. I was attending the convention 2 weeks before and i heard about him that he is speaking badly about pastors from his church to us.  All are calling him a LIAR. Is he a true pastor? What kind of politics is going on there? It is like president rule over there!

Good God Please show mercy!

One Brother

TVM

                                          

Dear Brother from TVM and others who read this,

It is absolutely right what you are saying. The Bethel church has bought 3 and a quarter acres not five acres. I was attending the Church for the first time a few sundays back. I was not getting spiritual food from my church so i went to that church. The Worship was more of a talent show only difference being there was whatsoever no talent. Anyway that not being the point here let me move to the more shocking things. Once the 'singing show'  was over, then the Senior Pastor who only wears white on the outside came onto stage and said a few things about himself and his ministry then after that started talking about another Pastor of the same church and saying all kinds of bad things about him openly. This was so embarrassing. My wife was constantly looking at me with disbelief hearing these things. I could not believe that such things were coming from a "man of God" who so many people respect. I am shaking even now and doubting if i should quote him. I agree with the brother from TVM about him blaspheming. It was total blasphemy. He preached about forgiving others and finally said we CANNOT and SHOULD NOT forgive certain people. My question is when did such a big Pastor like himself start being GOD and decide who to forgive and who not to forgive. His recent teachings i hear is very unbiblical and all his messages aim at revenge and poking revenge at his co-pastors. He was accusing a co-pastor of unbelievable things. Then then the Treasurer of the church got up and said a testimony where he said the senior pastor had accused him of stabbing him in the back. He said that he served the church as treasurer for almost 20 years faithfully and he was thrown out of position because he was slowly beginning to understand the politics that the Sr.Pastor and his sons were playing. The pastor told the church that he was not capable and forced the people to remove him. There is an eternal God who is looking at all this. Is this what Christianity is coming to? Are these the people who serve the Lords Table to us? Are these the People who we look up to as leaders.  It is our fault that we trust them and believe whatever they say. I Thank god for the discerning power he has given me. I could immediately feel the work of separation and deceit in that Pastors voice. Where is God's justice gone? My preyer is that the Lord almighty should show mercy and do something. It is these people who bring a bad name to the Lord and the christian Community.

To know more about this i asked the person who introduced me to the church, he said that the Sr.Pastor and his sons pay heavy bribes from the church money to bribe high court judges and officials and recently also the Police to work in their favor without documents. This is a shame. Are u not fearful about judgment day? What are all the journalists of SD Patram, Good news, Halleluiah, Defenender,  and other News papers doing? They should be honest and investigate into this matter and bring out the truth in this matter.

Why is nobody asking why the Land is written in the name of the Sr.Pastor? And why is the power of attorney given to his eldest son? Why not in the name of the committee? Why a respected Pastor like him get a fake certificate from Kerela stating that he is a agriculturalist with the help of another Pastor Kunju Kodiat from Tiruvalla ( He announced this publicly from the stage- no shame or what?) What is the diff between him and the underworld dons. He will tell everyone that people write like this about him because it is opposition from devil and devils evil scheme and poor people will believe and pray without ceasing. Why cant people ask questions. Are Malyalis and Kerala people so stupid to not understand this lies.

In Karnataka Politics scene former PM devegowda and his two sons are the ones who are playing dirty politics and in the Christian church Scene it is MAV and his two sons who are playing dirty politics.

Who is there to ask?. who is there to question? Who is there to stand for right. The Sr.Pastor said that the Church will grow fast and reach 25000 soon. Well.... in this state of affairs i see people leaving in a big way rather than the church growing. Rather than playing along with these politics and being a victim of their evil plans, two churchs (Hindi church and Kanada church) have left the church already and my sources say that four other pastors are going to leave soon. This means that the Bethel Ag Church that was 6500 in number have now reduced to 3500 members. Myt friend who introduced me to the church said that Time will only tell when Rev.Johnson will separate with his Bethel International Church. Rumor has it that very soon this will happen. I doubt the younger brother will stay under the rule of the elder brother. After all it started with Esau and Jacob, long back. The same thing will happen. Tamil church Pastor and his congregation also plans to leave the church soon.

People of God, my humble request to you is to not stand with Liars and deceivers but wake up and be not deceived. Otherwise you also will have to answerable on the Day of judgment. Be not fooled nor deceived.

Galatians Ch 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.

vs 8: The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

vs.9: Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

vs.10: Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.

 

I agree with brother from TVM in asking the lord to show mercy.

loving brother in Christ

Bangalore 

 

this is bad whats its happening in the church.. this is cheating God and HOLY SPIRIT. Bad bad bad... this is work of sepration and lucifer.

listen o' people of GOD...in all the religions and politics the peoples will follow the leaders,,,,but in modern pentecost they want the leaders to obey them.

 b'coz the satan knows that like all the other groups when people follow an annointed Pentecostal leader then his games will not work in the world..

 there is much understandings happening with the believers to satan thru, television and games. if peoples comeout together in light then they will be judged by the surrounding peoples itself....so they need to stay in dark and only need to go for a minimum worship and to get some satisfaction by supporting some poor missionaries...throwing resposibility to weekest.

they are not ready to act according to God's commands support the annointed leaders and they can serve you and the society from drowning.

without a great thought there will not be a massive work...keep away from sleeping leaders....

 a wellwisher...from desert.

The word politics, is understood in different ways depending on the readers knowledge, experience and understanding.. A definition of politics will make things clear. Where ever four people meet we can see politics there. We are created with a free will and naturally each one has his or her own self interest. Manifestations of this self interest we can see anywhere and everywhere- in our daily activities, church committees and general body meetings. Are we closing our eyes and make it dark when we say Pentecostals have no politics. Things I do in my self interest, is it not politics for another person?

 Ninan Mathullah

Houston

തിരുവചനപ്രകാരം, നേതാക്കന്മാര്‍ മാത്രമോ അഭിഷിക്തര്‍? വിശ്വാസികള്‍ അഭിഷിക്തരല്ലേ?

ദൈ‌വവും കര്‍ത്തവുമായ യെശുക്രിസ്തുവിനു സ്തുതി.

എല്ലാ വിശ്വാസികളും അഭിഷിക്തരാന്നെന്ന് ദൈവ വചനം പറയുന്നു.

അനാവശ്യമയി തിരുമേനി ചമയുന്നവര്‍ വലയും സംശയമില്ല.

സഭയില്‍ വലിപ്പ ചെറപ്പം പാറ്റ്ദ്ദ്ദ്റ്റെസെദ്വ്ക്ക്ഷ്ഗ്വ്ക്ക്ക്ഗ്വ്വ്ക്ഗ്ര്ന്മ്,ക്ക്,ഫ്വ്ര്ഹ്വ്ഗ്ര്, ദ്ന്‍ ഡില്ല.

 

 

Though what this writer has said is true from his own view point, it is a very narrow outlook. Can we have birds eye viw of things. Can we see things as Jesus see it. Recently a preacher was asked if it is ok for me to get involved in politics. The reply was, It is ok if Jesus has done it". The pesrson didn't reply, "I got married. It look like I did the wrong thing since Jesus didn't do it" Jesus is the most misunderstood person here. Jesus had no problem to make a whip and cast all the profiteers and thieves from the temple. When Jesus was beaten, he asked them why he was beaten without any valid reason. Nobody preach this side of Jesus' character. Over the years Jesus is pictured as a weakling who always show the other cheek. My Jesus was not like that. When Jesus said to show the other cheek it is only at a personal level. Even soldiers come and ask what we need to do and they were told to do their job.Due to selfishness and cowardice and concern for comfort, some wear a veil of spirituality to run away from troubling questions. We must join with other christian groups on areas where we can agree and raise voice against injustice against the weak in the society. Most of us react like the priest and Levite in the story of the Good Samaritan, pretend not seeing the need for action. What type of leaders we have now? Those who run away when the wolves are after the sheep, finding the veil of spirituality to escape leaving the sheep to its own fate. Pastor has an obligation to protect the sheep given in his protection. This rally at Trivandrum is not a show of strength but to bring the attention of Government at all level that is supposed to guarantee the protection of life and property of individuals and to live in peace as guaranteed in the constituition. It must be a warning to all those bullies who try to intimidate the weak in the society. There is nothing wrong in having representation in the assembly to glorify His name there or in the Minority Commission. This just hypocracy. Is it because some don't like the idea of sharing the respect and recognition, if there is a cabinet minister in the community. Is it because they always want to be the center of attention. In the Oldtestament and Newtestament time the gift to rule and administer is something that needs special annointment. Hope our believers will see things in its proper light and stand united behind this effort.

Ninan Mathullah

Houston

dear all believers..

the one who love more jesus will lead his people and that is made by jesus itself.

and the one who cannot hear the sound will not follow him.

we are not disciples of gandhiji....i mean he died and cannot speak thru his representatives..

 so dear saints.....we should not scrawl like a snake...but fly high like a eagle.in all matters. 

god bless you all....

 law

desert

dear

 if you have the annointing to lead; then you should wake up and learn your ways from GOD to become a leader.

if you are not ready to act as per annointing then you automatically create a great disruption to those acting per annointing.

or if your annointing is only for a biliever then you should offcourse follow the annointed leader..

please decide .

 

thanks

law

 

my brother,

all are annointed believers after getting baptism in holy spirit,

but GOD made authoritative ministries in church,,like first apostles,2nd prophets , 3rd shepherds.......have you aware?

this is the God's arrangements and will ; we should understand and better obey it.

and these all things are divided as per their level of holiness infront of GOD and our Lord.

 kindly advice

law

i have a suggestion for this not for joke.

the brother from TVM should visit Kunju Kodiat and have a prayer together...better fasting together for days.

and brother from banglore should sit with pr. varghese same as mentioned above and there will be a result

like any of you have been delivereed from evil spirits.

 brother the church problems are not recently happened and is from ist century.

i recommend not to judje a minister with out having an authority of spirit over it.

people will believe barabas than jesus these days because of influence....